Maggie
Hello and welcome everyone. I am so delighted to have Maisie Hill joining us today, it is going to be such a phenomenal conversation. First, I want to introduce you to who Maisie Hill is, she is a one stop powerhouse of knowledge, experience and treatments when it comes to period power. She is one of the world’s foremost experts on how to manage your menstrual cycle in a way that feels nourishing to your body and to your life. She has even been called “the womb whisperer,” which I think is amazing. And she has a book called Period Power, which is a very profound, very practical blueprint on how to manage your life in accordance with your cycles. And she’s just one of my most fascinating people that I get to talk to on a regular basis because she is a member of the Marriage MBA. And today, she graciously and kindly agreed to come on and talk about her experience in the Marriage MBA. But I’ve already asked her if she will come back and talk to us all about period power, because I think what she’s doing is so revolutionary, so innovative, and so powerful for all of us who have periods and want to live a life that’s integrated with who we are spiritually, mentally, emotionally, with our bodies and the life that we lead. So I cannot be more excited. Welcome, Maisie.
Maisie
Thank you for having me. I feel like I just want to take you around with me Maggie. I mean, I want to take you around with me anyway. But if you’re going to introduce me like that, yes, please.
Maggie
My pleasure. Love it. Okay, so I said a little bit about what you do, but I’d love for you to say in your own words. Tell us a little bit about what you do and how you help women just have a more integrated life.
Maisie
So my history is that as a teenager, and in my 20s, I had really debilitating period pain. And I went on a massive journey to heal that pain, which I eventually did. But along the way, I started training and all the things that were helping me and, you know, I started out doing this work as a practitioner and training in Chinese medicine and all those kinds of things, all with the aim of supporting the menstrual cycle and reproductive health throughout our life. And I was also a birth doula at the time too. So you know, everything was to do with wombs and ovaries basically, and hormones. And, you know, once as you’re finding, once people get to know you, and they’re like, oh, wow, this person does really amazing things and more people want you. And then people are like, “You should really write a book and you should, you know, find other ways of helping more people and being creating more impact in the world.” So that’s what led to me writing Period Power. And then Perimenopause Power, which comes out in two weeks in the UK.
Maggie
Oh, that’s so exciting. Do you know when it comes out in the US?
Maisie
I think it’s like three months behind. They stagger it.
Maggie
Yeah. Okay, so what we’ll do… I know everyone listening is gonna want to know everything about Period Power and Perimenopause Power?
Maisie
Yeah, Perimenopause Power.
Maggie
What we’ll do is we’ll link to your website. So anyone who wants the updates on when the second book is coming out, it probably won’t be out when this airs. So you’re gonna want to get the update for when it’s coming out in the US. You can also go to Amazon and pre order it because that’s what I have done. So you don’t have to worry about the date it comes out. So you hear us talk today, go to Amazon, look for Maisie Hill, Period Power is already there. And then Perimenopause Power you can pre order, and you’ll get it when it comes out. We’ll link to that in the show notes so you don’t have to remember all of that. So tell us, why did you want to join the marriage MBA? Tell me. Honestly, tell us anything you want to share Maisie.
Maisie
Okay. So, Period Power came out in 2019. So a couple of years, it’s like two years ago. And, you know, the writing period of that was really intense. And I was like really stretching myself as a person and as a professional. And I had a two year old at the time. So I was like, stretching myself as a mother as well. And like, I was really like, reaching these huge areas of growth. And they came with challenges, but I was like, really out kind of storming the world with what I wanted to do and like my purpose in life. And since then, I’ve continued to invest in my brain and in my business. And then last year, I was like, hold on, I had to get real with myself. I was like, I am investing in me. I’m investing significantly in my business. I’m doing all these things. And yet the one area of my life that actually needs attention, my relationship, I’m not investing in. Either with, you know, time, energy, showing up, or investing in getting some help to help me to do all of those things. And so it was really like a moment of reckoning and just being honest with myself, and looking at why. And I was like, okay, I’m actually scared to face some of the things and we have a very regular relationship. There’s nothing astonishing there, it’s just, you know, we’re a couple, we have a young child, we both run our own businesses, and there are challenges that come with that. But I was like, I think I had this opinion of like, this is gonna be really hard work to sort out. And I don’t, I’m at my bandwidth, I don’t have the capacity to make a change. And I was just kind of finding the safety in that. And the excuse in that. And at some point, I was just like, okay, it’s, that’s enough now.
Maggie
And first of all, I always want to just, I always honor you. And I always honor anyone who comes on to the show to say, sometimes we find out things about ourselves that are hard to see. And we want to do that with so much love and compassion. I mean, that happens to me in my own self coaching, and in my own coaching, where I’m just like, oh, here’s where I’m not showing up the way I would like to. Okay, that made sense in that moment, when you had, what all those things going on. That was the coping mechanism that worked, let’s not make that wrong. While we discover that we want to do something new and different. Let’s just know we’re in a different moment now. And then that’s okay. And I just wanted to say that for everyone, for you, and for everyone listening.
Maisie
No, I love that. And I think that’s like why — one of the many reasons why it’s so easy for me to be coached by you, and why I really wanted to work with you is because that is your approach. And there is this strong sense of compassion for us as humans. And like, hey, we’re all doing our best here, but is this actually what you want? Or do you want something different?
Maggie
That’s so important. That’s so important. So I know, you mentioned before we started recording that you made some notes, I always just like to ask what are some of your favorite takeaways or things you’ve experienced that have been useful for you. But I also want to be open to any direction that you want to take the conversation. So you tell us what you’d like to share. And we’ll kind of go from there.
Maisie
Oh man, there’s so many things to mention. And I think before, you know, cause I’ve had, I had like some really quick realizations, and then there’s kind of been some more recently as well. And I think what I wanted to say, I really, like came into this originally wanting to do one on one work with you. Yeah. And I was just in this kind of, you know, I’m autistic. And that’s something that I’ve recently found out. And I’ve been kind of adjusting to that knowledge. And I was really thinking that, because I’m autistic, that meant I would need one on one. And it’s so interesting now being in the group, because I can look at the other amazing people in our group and think, oh, I wonder if they probably came to this thinking, well, just because like, we all have our unique things. And we just, we just think that is, that means we can need one on one. And it’s been really interesting for me. And I remember when we first spoke about us working together, and you had said, I think it would actually be really useful for you to be in a group and to see that it’s not just you as someone who’s autistic who is facing these challenges, which is like really true…
Maggie
Exactly what happens. Yes. Yeah. First of all, it’s like actually, no other people have that problem, too.
Maisie
Yeah, I think that was like, my funniest moment was when I was just like, I just, you know, I’m autistic and something about autistic people is that we don’t like having to repeat ourselves. And, and then everyone was like, oh, no, that’s us as well. It was just like this hilarious moment. There’s just been so many moments like that. And that’s been such an amazing experience for me, because for me, it’s challenging to be in a group. Like I love one on one and I can speak to hundreds and 1000s of people without issue, but being in a group is like not my natural place to go. But I’ve loved it so much.
Maggie
And I just want to also thank you for speaking so openly about being autistic, both in the group and on the podcast now, because I think so many people will have something happen in their life, they’ll either get a diagnosis or a piece of information, or they’ll uncover something that makes them feel apart — that makes them feel outside of the quote unquote, norm, which there is no norm. But let’s just say, and for me, as a coach, and as a leader leads other people to say, Hey, everyone is welcome here.
Maisie
Yeah.
Maggie
We adapt as best as we can, if you need some special accommodation, we’re open to doing that. But also, I think that you’re doing amazing. Like, sometimes we put in our brain, oh, and then I have to do extra, or I have to do more, or it has to be different. And if that is the case, and it’s and it’s true and necessary, that’s great. But also, I can just be gentle with myself and do the best I can in every moment. And that could be alright, too.
Maisie
Yes. 100%. I love what you model for us is like, it’s okay to be messy. We can do nasty things in here. And we can figure it out.
Maggie
Yeah, I think it’s so important to normalize that marriages are messy. Emotions are messy. Right? Sex is messy. Right? When we think about having a fulfilling, thriving relationship with another human, there’s a lot of messiness involved at every level, even in the best scenario. And part of, I don’t know if it’s cultural programming, well, no, it is cultural programming — part of that perfectionistic tendency, part of that idea that it has to be or look one particular way, is hurting us so deeply. And I when I think about you with period power, it’s like, oh, women should be the same 30 days of the calendar. Right? And that’s the expectation like nobody, no one knocks on your door and says you should be the same 30 days of the calendar. But when we’re in school growing up, our assignments don’t change, the flow of our work doesn’t change. When we have jobs or have businesses, it’s just like, oh, no, we should be the same all 30 days of the calendar, when in fact, our bodies are not the same.
Maisie
Yes, 100% is just the same as like a 24 hour cycle day and night. Like, we wake up feeling one way, and then, you know, our energy and our mood shifts and that continues throughout the day and, you know, we just accept that as normal, no one like pathologizes it or makes it a problem.
Maggie
Right, And so I think leaning into the flow of who we are, like just leaning into, this is who I am, these are the things that are part of me, and how do we lean into that flow, but make it completely normal, that we lean into the flow of who everyone is, and just make that part of the process. Because you’re so open about it, you allow us to do that in a deeper way. And I just want to say thank you, for everyone listening who’s ever felt that way. Maisie is such a great role model for that, so thank you for that.
Maisie
I am going to receive all of that. That’s one of my things, one of my Maggie-isms, learning from you is receiving praise.
Maggie
Yeah. So it’s so powerful, it’s so important. So tell me a little bit about one of your favorite — either concepts that you’ve implemented, or moments that you had or anything like that, that you want to share of the impact you’ve been able to have in your relationship as a result of our work together in the group.
Maisie
I’m so excited to share these things. Okay. I have a list. So the first thing that just made a difference, like instantly, and that I’ve continued to do is like that thing of the power of working with a coach, and especially someone who’s experienced and as wise and has as much to offer as you do, is that sometimes it’s just that one question or that one thought, and it changes everything. And when we were talking on one of our first calls, I had mentioned how my tendency is to get defensive and to feel rejected, and to think like the world’s gonna end when really we’re just talking about the washing up or whatever.
Maggie
Yeah, totally. You’re not alone, by the way. Just understand we’ve all felt that way at some point. Yes.
Maisie
And you had just like casually mentioned, well, you know, when you’re having conversations with your partner, then you’re just getting information. And I was like, oh, this is a very different way of thinking about things. Because definitely when I’m talking to him, I’m not thinking this is just information. I’m making the information mean a whole lot of other things that may or may not be true. So it was just that that one idea that this is just information and that information is helpful and the more information we have, the more able we are to make powerful decisions in our relationships and our lives. And from then on, anytime we’ve been talking I will just be running. In my mind. This is just information. This is just information. This is just information. And it really stopped my nervous system from going into a strong response.
Maggie
Yeah.
Maisie
So that was the first thing. And then what kind of quickly followed after that was I was kind of reflecting on when we coach, and how I am, like one of the things I teach my clients to do is to yes, sometimes we can find other thoughts. And also what we can do is, like, just channel our feelings that we feel. And like, we can feel that in our body as a sensation, and just get there really quickly. And I’ve noticed that when I’m being coached, as soon as I start to feel defensive about something, I can very quickly just drop into feeling open and not getting defensive. And then I was suddenly like, oh, wait, I can transfer that skill into my relationship. And so that’s what I’ve been practicing more recently is that not getting into that defensive part and…
Maggie
Just practicing. So a couple of things, one of the things I want everyone to just really notice is how simple these things are. We always think it’s gonna be so complicated and take 57 steps, and so much introspection, and you know, it’s going to just be this whole, like, you know, like a hurricane of things that has to occur. And really, it’s like you had one thought, this is just information. And then you’ve lived into that thought over and over again, every day. Literally, it takes no extra time on your schedule, it’s during the conversations you’re already having. Right? And I think it’s so important and such a great example of how doable, a very simple tweak can be and the impact it can have in a relationship. Because one of the things that I always say, and Maisie has heard me say a lot is: the fight you don’t have, the fight you don’t start, is the fight you don’t have to recover from. Right? And so when you’re like, this is just information, and you don’t have an argument and it doesn’t escalate and become bigger, just in removing all this stuff you’re no longer recovering from. Even if you haven’t fully handled everything, just removing that part makes it easier. And it opens you up to more, just a more love, more connection, more things, all of that.
Maisie
Yeah. And it’s been amazing. And especially when now, I’m reflecting on it, I think back to my original thought when I thought about doing work on my relationship, it was like it was gonna be work, it was gonna be hard, because like, this is serious stuff. And like, these are tendencies I’ve had for 30 years, and it’s gonna take so much effort to change that.
Maggie
And we just want to also like acknowledge, like, sometimes it does feel harder than others. And we also let that be okay. Like, sometimes it’s hard when your partner is saying something that maybe you completely disagree with, to go back to, it’s just information like, it can be hard, we want to have that space for that. But it’s also highly likely that it’s so much easier than you think it is right now. And we really want to bring that to the awareness of just everyone who’s listening. And then I love the example that you gave of when you’re being coached, you drop into openness. And you thought, Oh, if I could do this, I’m being coached, what if I did this with my partner? And that’s just a great example of using skills you already have in your relationship. And I see this all the time with all my students and with all my clients, you’re incredibly successful at work, you’re incredibly successful in whether it’s running your home or running a business or running a department, whatever it is that you do. And it’s like you have this whole set of skills. And then when you go home, it’s like you get amnesia and you forget, you know how to do that. Right? Like you might know exactly how to deal with someone who’s in a stressful situation. And then you’re home. And then your partner is in a stressful situation. You’re like, I don’t know what to say, I don’t know what to do. But actually, you know exactly how to do that. And one of the things I do so often is just remind everyone, hey, you already know how to do that over here. What if you pointed that laser over there?
Maisie
Yeah, it makes such a difference. And I think there was also like, this really lovely point, you know, and just kind of it feels like different parts of your life or kind of it’s like all the cogs just shift a little bit and then they kind of line up and start working together. And when we were doing some work around the nervous system response and stress. We did that the exact same month that I was focusing on stress in my membership.
Maggie
Yes, yes.
Maisie
So I had been like really geeking out on lots of research and then like, we were coming at it from a different way. Within our work, and then suddenly, I realized something that was going on when I was like having, you know, a discussion or a falling out or like, you know, approaching a topic that felt scary in my relationship. And I would notice that as the conversation would go on, and my nervous system was being activated, but in my mind, the thoughts I would be having was like, you should just leave this relationship. And that’s like, that’s been my historic tendency is that any kind of slightly heated discussion, and it can be very slight, my brain is just like, instantly, like, let’s get out of here. And I suddenly realized, oh, I don’t actually mean, let’s get out of here. What is going on is my nervous systems going: this is scary. We’ve got to run.
Maggie
Yes.
Maisie
I was like, oh, all these years, I was thinking that is an actual thought that I need to believe, but actually, it’s just my body trying to protect me when there’s a perceived threat going on. And it’s not an actual threat. This is a conversation with my loving partner. The world is not going to end. And I could then just start to be in conversation with my body about what’s going on.
Maggie
Yes. That’s so good. I can start to be in conversation with my body about what’s going on. Tshat is so powerful.
Maisie
Because before I was just believing my brain, I have to leave this relationship. This is the worst relationship ever. What are you doing here? Instead of like, oh, I love this guy. And he’s just telling me stuff.
Maggie
Yeah, I love this guy. He’s just telling me stuff. I love that so good. And notice the difference in something that comes up a lot in any type of coaching is all or nothing thinking. Instead of thinking, I just need to leave this conversation. Or maybe we should leave this topic to the side for a moment, right? And we go from the smallest thing, which is maybe dropping that topic for a little bit if we need to, to I just need to leave the whole entire thing. Move to another country, you start fresh, like, right?
Maisie
Yeah, cause that works.
Maggie
Cause that works. Right. So I just invite everyone listening to think about that when we have that moment of, which is a natural stress response, which is just the flight, you know, fight or flight, just flight. It’s like, am I trying to fly away from everything, or maybe I just need to fly away from the smallest part of this, which might just be changing the topic, leaving it for later, coming back to it when I’m more centered. And one of the things we talk about in the group a lot is how stress affects a relationship and how understanding how to manage our stress better will have a direct impact on managing our relationship better.
Maisie
Yes, absolutely. That’s it. Yeah.
Maggie
Yeah. What else on your magic list there?
Maisie
So then the other one is, you know, what you’ve shared with us around the no complaining, no defending.
Maggie
Yes.
Maisie
And I felt so, I was like, cognitively I was like, oh, yeah, Maggie, this sounds great. And then oh, hold on a minute. I don’t actually want to do this. I just felt so much resistance. And I would say he might have a different opinion. We spoke about it the other day, I think we kind of come at it from the same point of view that my partner’s tendency is to complain. My tendency is actually it is to complain, but to complain internally and not say it out loud. So the things I say out loud is the defending and, and this is so you know, I have just realized in the past few weeks how I, the thought that I have because it’s not true, like I want to believe is true, is that I misunderstood. And I have to over-explain and I have to defend and like, and I’ve just been, like letting it sit in me the last couple of weeks of like, what would my relationship be like, if I just decided that I am always understood? And I’m, like, I’ve just been letting that possibility be there, because like, I feel that initial resistance. And I’m like, oh, wait, if this was possible things would be different. And then now I’m kind of working my way into the next level of things. But that has been really big for me. And I think, you know, certainly in conversation with my other half then, you know, the idea of me not defending myself is like, massive.
Maggie
Yeah. Sometimes our partners, we’ll do one little tweak and they’ll be like, who are you and why aren’t you arguing with me right now? Like what happened to you?
Maisie
Yeah, and that did happen like on a couple of times where I was just doing that practice of being open to what he was saying and finding the truth in what he was saying. You know, sometimes you say things and I feel that like getting defensiveness. And I’m like, okay, why am I getting defensive here? Is it because there’s some truth in what he was saying? And so I would first go to the place of finding where is this true? And then kind of once I’d like clean that up for myself, I would be able to then approach things in a more neutral way. And think, like, well, where is the stuff that is to do with us? And that’s maybe to do with him, but at least I’m clear on my side of things. Yeah.
Maggie
And so one of the things that that points out, and I just really want everyone who’s listening to know is the biggest focus we have in the marriage MBA program, is our mindset. So it’s literally called The Marriage Mindset Breakthrough Activator. And that was very intentional in calling it that way. So when Maisie’s giving these examples, she just is tweaking how she’s thinking about the relationship. And in those tweaks, one thought here, one question there. She’s showing up differently to the relationship and the way she’s interacting with her partner. And I just, for someone who’s never done anything like this, right, I want to point out, that’s literally what’s happening. It’s one different thought, one question asked over and over and over again, in every, you know, permutation and situation. And then what happens is, we show up with that intention for openness, or that intention for kindness or that intention that it’s just information and let me gather some more. So maybe we should, we would never ask questions of our partner. And now suddenly, we’re like, well, tell me more, walk me through your thought process, help me understand, and suddenly our partner’s sharing more than ever before, not because we sat down and gave him a lecture and said, hey, you should share more.
Maisie
Well, it’s been that’s been the other, I think, really interesting thing, because, you know, sometimes we need help, right? Sometimes we can… Sometimes someone else can ask us questions. And that helps us get to our truth and like, what is going to be useful for us. And then there’s also times where we just need someone else to tell us and give us some examples of things. And that was it for me, because,
I’m not great with small talk. Like, I know that that’s just support as well. But it’s easier for me, it’s easier for me, as I think particularly as someone who’s autistic to just go all in on like my subjects that I like to talk about, like the menstrual cycle and like hormones. And so just the kind of day to day stuff in a relationship. And the back and forth is a challenge for me. It doesn’t come as naturally to me, and, and I that is a frustration for my boyfriend. Because he will say things and I just, and he’s like, did you hear me? Or like what’s going on? And I just don’t know how to respond to that. And it’s just something light, it’s not even like something challenging that I’m like, oh, I’ve got no idea how to respond to that. He’s just telling me something fairly insignificant about his day as a point of us to connect and to just talk, but I’m often just there looking at him, like a deer in headlights going, what the fuck do I say to him? Now? I don’t? I don’t know. And so that was a really fun coaching session, when we were kind of coming up with questions I could ask and that you helped me to realize that I don’t always have to have a response, I can just ask questions. And he can respond more. And that was really helpful for me.
Maggie
And I love that you mentioned that because in the group, one of the things that we do is it’s a group setting, but each person has a turn to be coached, you know, as we do the different workshops and different things that we do as part of the group. And one of the times that means us being coached, we just brainstormed a bunch of questions. And here’s what I want to say about that. You don’t have to be original. You don’t have to think of a new thing every time. Like there are no points for originality. Like in this particular case. So if you have a situation like that, where you’re just not sure how to engage with the other person, I’m a big fan of have bullet points, have a list. Help yourself be comfortable. Put it in your phone to help you remind yourself, right? Just when I say be curious for like, I don’t know what that looks like. Okay, it could look like tell me more. Right? And if you just walk around and say tell me more 1000 times the person that’s actually in relationship with you will just be oh, wow. She’s so curious about everything I do. It’s amazing. I love telling her more. That person does not care the format of the question. What do you think about that Maisie?
Maisie
Yeah that’s 100%. It’s is that thing, you know, like The Gottman Institute talks about just that turning towards each other. Like, okay, I don’t have to turn toward you with like a perfect response. I just have to turn towards you somehow.
Maggie
Yes. Somehow in anyhow, anyhow is good. Yeah. That’s how much I quote the Gottman Institute a lot in my work. I love the research that they do. I love that it’s evidence based. And so when I make recommendations, part of it is my intuition, right as a coach or asking you a question, but part of it is also we know what makes relationships thrive. This is not a mystery, we have the data, then it’s like what is in the way between you and making the relationship thrive? That’s what we coach on.
Maisie
Yes, I love that.
Maggie
Okay, anything else in your notes before we move on to something else?
Maisie
Hmm. I think again, just like to return probably on a similar theme there of just being autistic. And think I was, I started out making that mean a lot more about my communication style. And I think perhaps even in my relationship, that maybe my partner was, you know, and we’re still kind of figuring that one out. And you’re helping us to do that. But it was just realizing like, actually, two humans, we have different communication styles, and like whether I was in a relationship with someone else, or he was in a relationship with someone else who wasn’t neurodiverse, there would still be that work to do, somewhere along the line. And like, that was just such a relief to me. And, and, you know, something, I suspect we all come to Relationship Coaching with, as we think like, oh, it’s just us going through this, it’s just me. If only I could do this differently, if only he could do or they could do it differently. And that’s just such a kind of understated benefit of being in a group is like recognizing yourself and others. And, you know, there’s always the benefit of when you’re not in the hot seat, you sometimes get to see your brain more than when you are in the hot seat.
Maggie
Yes, yes. So one of the most powerful things both for me as a coach coaching and group and for me as a client in the groups that I have been in, is when you hear someone else being coached on something, your stress cycle does not engage. Your fight and flight is like turned off, you’re totally relaxed, and you’re just open and listening. And that allows you to learn the lesson that you may never have gotten if you were in the hot seat and first handling your fight or flight and then trying to listen.
Maisie
Yeah, totally, like even this week in our session, you were coaching someone, I knew I wanted to get coached on something and you coached someone else first. And I could feel myself, I was like figuring out what I wanted to be coached on as you were coaching them. And at the end I was like, do I still need to get coached? I was like, well, I’m gonna get coached anyway. And we’re gonna kind of just go through it, but it was like, I’d already got to a certain place already, which meant that then when we did approach my stuff I’d done that foundational stuff earlier in the session.
Maggie
Yes. Isn’t that so powerful? Yeah. So that’s one of the benefits of being in a group coaching setting is by the time we got to her specific situation she had already processed, just from listening to the other coaching had gotten more clear and been in that relaxed open state to get that clear. And then when we did her coaching, and because it was this week, I remember, we went to this very deep and powerful and beautiful place with it.
Maisie
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it was just because I, feel like I think just softened up. Yeah, you know, it was like, work through it. And then where you took me, I felt able to go. And that’s just, again, testament, to your ability to hold space, but also everyone else in the group and how it has space for each other.
Maggie
Yeah, and I love that you said that I’m going to do a whole episode on holding space coming up in a few weeks. But I want to talk about this now, which is one of the assumptions of the group is everybody’s on your side. Everybody wants you to win, everybody wants you to succeed. We’re all there to help each other. And I remember very vividly one of my very first experiences of that was I went to Toast Masters to learn how to speak. I knew I would be doing a lot of speaking and I stood up and I remember giving my very first speech. And everybody was applauding me even as they were giving me feedback on things I could improve and things I could do better. They just so wanted to see me win. And that’s really, like I had that visceral experience of in my own experience, and it’s really something that is very important to me to cultivate in the group, which is this idea like wait, were all in this together when you win and you have a breakthrough and you share it with a group that helps everybody else in the group win. And there are not a lot of spaces on this earth, where we can be surrounded by people where everybody wants to see us win. And I just think that’s so important and so powerful. So thank you for mentioning that.
Maisie
Oh, I completely agree. And it’s, I was kind of reflecting on this in preparation for our conversation, because I was thinking about how I think especially right now, with the pandemic, and it’s, I think, even pre-pandemic, when you are in a relationship, and often it’s a long term relationship, and then all the people around you are maybe in long term relationships as well. And then really, all the discussion about relationships, in my experience, tends to be complaining, wishing something was better. And, and I just think it’s so important to be in an environment where you are seen, acknowledged, accepted as who you are, and where you are at in your relationship, but also, that there is this strong culture of celebration. And of us all, what’s it was that phrase, a rising tide lifts all?
Maggie
Yes, exactly. That Yeah.
Maisie
And it’s like that, because I was thinking that maybe that would have been different. If we had have done one on one work. Because then I would have just been going to like my regular friends. And going, oh, this happened in my coaching session with Maggie. And then this is and like, maybe there might be some resentment from their part. And all like they weren’t going through that experience as well. And it makes it harder to do that work outside of the session. Whereas because, you know, we have our Facebook group, and we get to talk about things and, you know, and we’re all kind of checking in and celebrating things. And you know, when things like really sink in, and we realize something, and we show up, and we share it and we learn from each other. And that’s made a real difference. For me, just to be in that dedicated environment. Yeah,
Maggie
I love that. You mentioned that because being in a room with women — because this is a group of four women. So being in a group, with women who all want the same goal, we’re all working towards that goal, and who are taking positive, proactive, powerful action towards that goal, in an environment where there’s no complaining and no defending, by the way, there’s a podcast episode called Emotional Weight Loss, we’ll link to it in the show notes, I go in depth about it there, then I go in depth about it in the group. This is a core teaching that if you work with me, you need to know this is part of what we will do. It’s super powerful. Like Maisie said, it’s not always easy, but it’s super powerful. But being in an environment where this is the standard, this is how we look at our relationships, right. And then having other people also going through that, and also feeling the challenges and also getting stuck and then getting unstuck and moving forward. It’s so different than just telling a friend who isn’t in that environment and in that same situation.
Maisie
Yeah, because I don’t know anyone who’s celebrating their relationship right now, like outside of our group. And, you know, they all just need to come work with you, basically.
Maggie
Everyone, come on over. But here’s the thing, I think a culture — so our modern, sort of westernized industrial culture. My hypothesis is we overwork and under celebrate in every area of our life. And it’s something that I have seen in my HR days, I’ve seen it in my sort of personal life, for myself, we’re always that what’s next culture? This amazing thing, and what’s next and what’s next. And I make my students slow down. Sometimes it’s annoying, that’s alright. You know, I love them. I make them slow down to celebrate, and notice and marinate and savor the wins.
Maisie
Yes. And even you know, after I introduced the emotional weight loss to my partner the other day, and we were talking about the no complaining, no defending, and we decided that’s what we were going to do. And then like a day in, I said, I just really want us to celebrate that we’ve done 24 hours of no complaining, no defending and like it felt easy. To me at least and to him too, but and he was just like we’ve only just started and like, I know we have, but the getting started can be the hardest part. And I just want us to like, appreciate what we’re doing along the way.
Maggie
That’s so important. It’s so so, so powerful. So tell me something that comes to mind that has been hard or challenging. where we want it like one of the things when I talk about coaching, in general, I’m going to talk about working in your marriage in specific. I never want to sugarcoat how hard it can be, or how challenging it can be like, there are those moments where we’re just, we just need to cry, or whatever it is that we need to do. So if there’s something that comes to mind, whether it was in receiving a moment of coaching, or whether it was an implementing something, what was something that was hard. But as you’ve worked through it, you found that it was worth it, that it was hard.
Maisie
So I think one thing that was hard for me was, you know, when I was realizing or kind of questioning well like, why is it that when Maggie asks me questions, I can be open to what you’re asking me. And like, find the answers. But if he asks me questions, it’s a different response. And I was like really exploring that for myself. And I had to, again, just be honest with myself, and realizing that I was valuing you as my coach, but that I wasn’t valuing him as my partner. And what he had to say, and that was like, a hard realization. That was like, even now like it, it hurts. Yeah, you know, to realize that, but it’s made such a difference. Because, again, it’s been like part of the puzzle of figuring out like, how do I listen to him?
Maggie
Yes!
Maisie
How can I listen to him? How can I not get defensive here? How can we be solution focused? And working? Yeah, you know, yeah, that’s made such a difference to us. Like there’s been a couple of times you’ve been talking, we’ve just gone off track. And I thought like, and I’ve just said, I think the conversations moved us away from what we were talking about. And just isn’t, you know, it’s just like, these little things.
Maggie
Yeah. Those little moments. Just come back. Just come back. Yeah. So beautiful. Thank you for sharing with that. Because that’s something that’s very tender. Like it’s tender in our heart to say, oh, wait, this is the person I love the most. And it haven’t been showing up as if that was true. Yes. Sometimes one of the things I’ve given for homework very often over the years is just, what if we made a pact that we talk to each other as if we love each other? Right? That we listen to each other as if we love each other. Even sometimes, in those moments when we’re frustrated with the person that can feel a little bit difficult, right? But it’s like, wait, what if we talked and listened as if we love each other? Then what? So anything else you want to add? Before we start wrapping up?
Maisie
I think, you know, the coaching that I received from you this week, of just like, it’s okay for me to be angry about the things that I’m angry about right now. And you know, that I can just sit with that and, and be angry at patriarchy, and expectations according to gender roles. And in, you know, as we kind of, as I realized, in you coaching me that allowing that to be in my relationship is important, because it’s there, it’s in my relationship, whether I vocalize it or not.
Maggie
Right. Exactly. Yeah.
Maisie
It has a presence in me. And, you know, I think my tendency is that I am really great at coaching myself through things. I’m like, you know, and to have you say, what if this is something that you don’t have to coach yourself out? Or what if you just get to be in this? And really experienced this, and then we can go from there.
Maggie
Yeah. So one of the principles that I think is really important and how I teach, is that every emotion is welcome here. And if that’s true, then we have the fun emotions, we want to welcome those. When we feel loved and connected and sexy or in admiration for our partner or acknowledgement for ourselves. We want to welcome all of those — sometimes those are hard to welcome too, right? Like Maisie’s working on receiving so she’s working on that. And then there’s this other element of with every emotion is welcome here and then when I get angry, I don’t need to jump right out of it. I just need to let myself be there. See what is it that anger is trying to tell me? What is its purpose in this moment? And then decide what I want to do with it as opposed to sort of trying to jump right out of it.
Maisie
Yeah. And it’s that I think the importance of having and in sentences. You know, like, I can love my son, and I can love my partner, and I can love that I have this close attachment to the human that I birthed and nursed and all of those things. And I can be frustrated by the importance of that attachment, and that it can make it more challenging for me to be a working parent. Whatever the case may be.
Maggie
I love that — use and. Okay. One of the things I like to do as we wrap up the episode, is ask you a random question from the Questions for Couples Journal. So I have opened it to a random page. And here is the question. And I think it’s so perfect to end our show today. What delights you the most about your relationship with your partner? We spent the whole hour talking about some of the challenges and how you’ve overcome them and all those things. So what delights you the most about your relationship with your partner?
Maisie
He’s quite fun. You know, and that was just something that I’ve been working on bringing back and, and that we used to really have, you know, in the early days, and, and that’s been going really well, it’s just bringing back the laughter. And again, the challenge of that is like, recognizing my responsibility in that and seeing, like, where I have been focused on my work, you know, and there are seasons. You know, where that’s gonna happen. And like, that’s going to be my focus. And I don’t, I don’t have a problem with that. I’m like, I’m on board with that. But, you know, that I now I’m taking responsibility for the consequence of that, which means that, you know, I am sometimes in a stress response, when if I wasn’t, I’d be able to have a laugh with my other half, and like, we’d be having more fun. So, yeah, so his, I mean, sometimes, you know, he just gets me laughing and like, I really laugh, like, cackle. And I don’t stop and he like, makes fun of how I laugh whilst I’m laughing, which then makes it even harder for me to stop. And, you know, just I think we — that adventure? I think, you know, it’s like, curiosity and interest. And he’s just, he worked on a market stall when he was growing up. And he’s just such a great judge of people. And like, of like, understanding human behavior. It just fascinates me that he can do that. That’s the thing, like choosing to be fascinated by our partners, right?
Maggie
Yeah. Yeah. I vote for that one, choose that one. Take that away for today. Let’s all be fascinated by our partners. Let’s just do that one thing and see the impact that that has on your relationship. That is the perfect note to end on. Thank you so much for being here. Everybody, go follow MaisieHill.com is her website. She has a fabulous Instagram. If you’re on Instagram, just look for Maisie Hill, and start following her. It’s just how you’ve heard her today. It’s wise and fun and deep and has a mix of all of that in it. So definitely do that. Thank you again, for coming.
Maisie
Thank you so much, Maggie. And just before we wrap up, I just really want to acknowledge you because you’re just amazing. And you were like on my list of someone that I wanted to work with for for a while before I got in touch with you. And what I love most about you is how you embody love. Like to me, you are just love. Like that’s just how I see you and how, what you radiate. And I think that’s really important to me is that that’s what you model. And that’s what I see. And I like and I really see that in you and the messiness of it as well. It’s not like…
Maggie
Yeah, yeah, it’s not perfect.
Maisie
It’s not perfect, but I just think I love you to bits.
Maggie
Thank you so much. I receive that.
Maisie
Oh, can I add in something else? I’ve just thought of something else as well. I have felt so grown up because of our relationship.
Maggie
Tell me more.
Maisie
This has been really interesting for me because this is the thing like you said we would like you to show up to coaching because of your romantic relationship. But then you see all the other benefits of this. And so I’ve also been thinking about that and you know my training is as a practitioner where it’s like boundaries. And you, you know, work with someone’s a practitioner and you can’t be friends and all of these things. Yeah. And so, and I’ve just, I’ve said to you like, I find it really amazing that, that you are my coach, and you are my peer. And you are my friend now. And I just find it fascinating how now I’m able to hold space for those different relationships and roles, and for there still to be boundaries. And I just feel very grown up because of that. So thank you.
Maggie
You’re very welcome. I want to mention that it’s like when we’re coaching, we’re coaching, when we’re friending. We’re friending. Right. And, and so for anyone listening now, Maisie and I did know each other before she joined the group. So there was a foundation of loving connection there, right, once you join. But it is important to me to have those clear spaces in between and have them be very clear and let them be messy. And it’s like, oh, did I cross the line? You can always call me on it if I did. Right? Yeah, that kind of thing. I think that that’s very important to model and to just practice. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. We will be back next week with more fabulous resources for you to help you make your marriage stronger. I’ll see you then.